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gdiva

Trooper

Offline

Top players goes down

http://weewar.com/game/126177

Maybe this team will finally beat the Undefeated

http://weewar.com/game/127422

Warmaker

Berserker

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I'm still waiting for a team to take on Me, Frongbak, and BenjaminFranklin. We have never played as a team, but I bet we can worry some of you skilled teams who play together.

hugobrain

Raider

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Still a bit early for http://weewar.com/game/127422...
But yeah, Sicro / Hugobrain / Typhoooon get some good action going:
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Vs Juffe/matt538/Riipperi:
- http://weewar.com/game/124103
(Sicro/Hugo lead)

- http://weewar.com/game/131676
(Still Hanging - early)
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Vs jeffh/iRoam/gdiva:
- http://weewar.com/game/127422
(Still Hanging, mini-lead Sicro/Hugo/Typhoon)

- http://weewar.com/game/128727
(Still Hanging - early)

Lucian

Berserker

Offline

I'm playing against Sicro, sharky123 and Typhooon and they've got one mean game going. Good players all around. Europe would be a great map for a tournament.

Riip

Heavy Trooper

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Quite a few games played recently on v4.02 (BRP vs YGW). What's the consensus on fairness? It seems to me that BRP is the harder side to play, but I can't remember playing a single game as YGW, so maybe it's just me...

DirtStyx

Tank

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Riipperi wrote:Quite a few games played recently on v4.02 (BRP vs YGW). What's the consensus on fairness? It seems to me that BRP is the harder side to play, but I can't remember playing a single game as YGW, so maybe it's just me...


In our game BRP is doing fairly well no thanks to me. I was overly aggressive in the beginning and couldn't consolidate, but War and Dark are doing fine.

http://weewar.com/game/127356#nowhere

that said it was a hell of alotta fun to play

Darkbee

Berserker

Offline

I'm not sure I would use such a strong a term as "fine", more "hanging on by the skin of my teeth", but still as you said, a lot of fun to play.

hugobrain

Raider

Offline

I think indeed BRP has much less chance to win vs a decent YGW.
Here are my observations:
Advantages of YGW:
- Yellow: only 1 front, to push Red. Better income base than red (about $1600 in due time). One must play poorly to be pushed back by red.
- Green: Only 1 front, Blue. Better position: more early income, ports are closer to hit the African coast, more and better ports and airports.
- White: Can resist long enough to bring about the collapse of Red. Good income. Purple an indirect front: purple doesn`t have enough land bases to threatens White the way Red is threatened. Can delay Purple and throw whatever extra on Red.

- Blue: Outmatched in its fight vs Green. I yet have to see a Blue win in the naval battle vs Green. Green sea mastery allows him to hit anywhere: Africa, Spain, Southern France. Blue can hit white a bit. Only has 1 good port in the Med, and the adjacent airport is quickly under naval fire. 1 front only, unless you push against white, but then Green is eating you anyway. Facing a bigger guy is no fun.
- Purple: will be the last to fall, but does not have enough punch to break White fast enough to save Red. Against a good White, Purple will stall around $1200. Can only build 1 good unit per turn (boat or plane). Cannot really hope to swamp a decent White. Will have sea and air mastery, but will have a hard time getting inland. Scandinavia is a side show.
- Red: Red is the first to fall. No good port on the Black Sea. Not enough income for 2 big enemies. Red will face yellow ($1500+) and half of white ($800+) and can best hope to line up a solid core base of $1000, he`ll soon have to fight for the other bases, and cannot hope to stay at $1500 for many turns. 26,5 and 27,11 will usually be white. 29,13 usually goes to yellow. 36,14 is soon under yellow fire too. A quick white can reach Finland before red (23,0 and 25,0). Red is hell. Can hope to delay, but not to push back Yellow.

The map would need further editing. Don`t get me wrong, I love it, the best map IMO. I`ll try my hand at improving a bit the red and blue position in the coming weeks...

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What I totally want to try is BWY vs PGR. Each player would then have at least 2 fronts to deal with. Who`s in?
- Blue will be the new Red, facing a real 2 front battle. Build a Navy in the Atlantic Ocean or in the Med. Link with White and control France. Synchronize with White to kill Green or Purple...
- White will have to fight on 3 fronts, like Green, so he won`t be able to eat at Red too much. The teaming with Blue opens a new axis.
- Yellow will still eat Red, but will also have to help Blue and Red by blasting Green. So we`ll see the (slow) developmnent of a Yellow navy.

- Purple will now have to fight Blue and White. Can be threatened on the mastery of the sea if Blue pushes this way. A landing in France will be hard to maintain. But Green is not far...
- Green will have a 3 front war, like White. Best change: no more linear Green-Blue battle. Green will be fun and challenging: battle in the Alps, sea battles vs a creeping yellow, and try to deal with blue...
- Red will have more chance to survive, since both White and Yellow will have more pressure, having now to deal with Green, which has a powerful base. Will have more chances to expand in a solid core. If Green goes full on vs Yellow in a sea mastery, Yellow will be quite threatened, and Red will be able to push inland...

Yellow and Green will be the slowest front to develop, but at least it will be a new front.

I love this map! So that was my feedback on it.

Darkbee

Berserker

Offline

Good observations hugobrain, that describes almost perfectly what is happening in our game. I'm playing as red and I can tell you that it sucks big time!

Blue is being crushed by green, while purple is having a hard time pushing white out of the game, which would allow me to stave off yellow.

Like I said, it's been a fun game but I think defeat is inevitable for blue, red and purple.

hugobrain

Raider

Offline

Yeah that`s what I saw in the 6 or so Europe games I played.
Sucks to be red. I`d like to try that color, but I think it`s doomed anyway. Must be better in FFA. In fact, it`s seeing yellow and green playing FFA that made me realize how cool BWY vs PGR would be!

Juffe

Raider

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hugobrain wrote:
What I totally want to try is BWY vs PGR. Each player would then have at least 2 fronts to deal with. Who`s in?


I'm in.

VTTruck

Berserker

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we've tried a few with BGR vs PWY and its been fairly even. Purple gets a early lead on blue but blue ends up with more income if played properly. the real kicker in every game seems to be green v white.

Sicro

Trooper

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i'm also in !

Chubain

Heavy Trooper

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I've played this map a couple of times and I agree that BPR have a disadvantage. I don't think it is a huge imbalance, but it does need some minor tweaking. Here is the last game we played: http://weewar.com/game/110264

All six players in our game are very good, so it was a very tough game. As you can see I played red and it was very difficult. As the red player both yellow and white can stuff/block you quickly. I was able to secure 16 bases at my strongest point but never able to capture a port. Yellow was able to blast me repeatedly from sea which put me at a huge disadvantage for the rest of the game. After about turn 13-15 I (red) was in defensive mode for the rest of the game. Yellow was going to kill me with enough time, so my only hope was to hold the line and pray that Blue and Purple can gain ground faster then I lost ground. I was able to hold out long enough for my teammates to save me, but playing over half the game in survival mode sucks. The moral of the story is BRP can win, but it is very difficult.

If teams remain BRP vs WGY, I think purple or red need to have more income. If purple had additional income they could really press white from the start which would mean red would be given a break on the western front. Red would still have to contend with yellow, but it wouldn't be a full squeeze from both the west and south. Conversely, if red was given more income it would still be a defensive game, but it would much easier to hold the line as your allies attempt to save you. I personally like the idea of additional income for purple since playing "defense" as Red in every game isn't all that fun. I think every army should have the potential to be the one attacking and pushing the front(s). As the game stands now Red will always be in the defensive role. Another way to tweak the game would be to make it possible for Red to capture and hold and USE a port(s) against yellow. I don't think there is anyway for Red to capture a port south and use it against yellow as the game stands. Even if you luck out and manage to capture a port and actually build a ship, you still have to deal with yellow being able to build from 3-4 ports that are all in range of your 1 port. That is a lose/lose/lose/lose situation against a good player.

I like hugobrain's idea of BWY vs PGR. It would be interesting to test that game out. Yellow needs to have two fronts to consider. That would probably help Red survive and either gain ground against white and/or yellow.

I'm always open for an unrated Europe game. Send and invite.

Chubain

CaptainCupCake

Tank

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I think BRP seems reasonably even. Count me in for any unrated variation; I too love the map

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